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J Taylor's avatar

But when the whites (the edomites) are replaced by people with a stronger sense of identity historically and maybe genetically, will america remain america?

Already indians in america use the H1B system to further their ethnic group strenghth in america.

In south africa, blacks will consistently vote for parties that promote racial agendas even at the cost of the countries economy and even their own pocket but which furthers a small minority of Cadres with which they identify.

https://thecontemporaryheretic.com/2022/03/01/pierre-van-den-berghes-the-ethnic-phenomenon-ethnocentrism-and-racism-as-nepotism-among-extended-kin/

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meika loofs samorzewski's avatar

Conservatives often get caught up on boundary issues to give meaning, so the external threat makes sense, but not everyone is conservative, so how do societies function where not everyone everywhere and everywhen feels that to be obvious. How is it most of the time do we get along despite motivation differences in how we think we get along.

The key thing about reading Henrich for me wasn't the church-cousin wrongness, or even weirdness, but the idea of ***inter-group competition _for_ individuals***.

This is anathema for many conservatives who base their worlding on policing the boundary (emotionally or ideologically driven) (and so micro-worlding as tribes-nations-bloods-soils-etc).

Inter-group competition upturns closed-boundary group-competition fixations. The old idea of group-competition holding individuals in some weird blood collective is plain wrong _in the long term_ even if attractive to some members of the population.

A fixation on war and glory is a short-sighted attempt to find some use for the conservative preference in policing boundaries, when the rest of us just get on with life and its practicalities. It is this perverse want for war that unites the libertarian disruptor with the conservative hunt for glory. Even if the conservative does it in the name of stability, so at odds with disruption (I think they mean revolution really, which is of course a type of civil war).

We can even see slavers' worlding (rebranded later in the USA as race) as a type of perverse competition for individuals minus their individual-ness.

Your migrant stories highlight the _for_ individuals aspect of inter-group competition. I do not think even Henrich covers this in depth enough. But I've only read two books of his.

I find Turchin's focus on elites a little too much. Surely, and this can be argued both ways i guess, if we do not police narcissists and psychopaths then they will exploit any binary forming differences to generate narcissistic supply, and the real question is not over-supply of X they exploit, but what conditions are there---- in which boring-humdrum-stability-of-a-society is overcome by the constant entropy provided by narcissists and psychopaths (so small in number) that these parasites overcome the host and instants of society (nation/tribe/family/firm/club/church/) are overturned--- as history becomes just one damned narcissist after another.

The elite disputes are then just symptomatic. I suspect elites are always in overproduction. Isn't that how evolution works, do I need mention Malthus?

Surely the main practicality we must deal with is our failure to police narcissists and their ability to wreck everything?

https://whyweshould.substack.com/p/reading-joseph-henrich-one

https://whyweshould.substack.com/p/reading-joseph-henrich-two-social

https://whyweshould.substack.com/p/reading-joseph-henrich-three-ish

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